Brough Superior (Lawrence of Arabia)

Smittie61984 · 11-25-2011, 10:21 PM

I have a history project thingy where we had to pick a historical movie and write about something within the movie that may be inaccurate or just interesting. Such as say in a Vietnam movie having soldiers use a current generation M16 vs using a 1st generation M16.

I picked Lawrence of Arabia because I knew of the motorcycle scene and that T.E. Lawrence was a motorcycle enthusiast. Specifically with the Brough Superiors.

Now being that they made the movie in the early 60s and Brough quit making their bikes in the early 1940s I'm guessing that no one in hell would actually crash/lay down a real Brough Superior (if they did they should be slowly tortured to death) which they did in the movie. I figured they tried to replicate the bike with another brand of bike. I think they did that in a Tom Cruise movie by dressing a KTM up as a Ducati Hypermotard.

Does anyone know what actual bike they used in the movie?

Here is the scene:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GzPr3R3DNoo

I can tell the exhaust is different from Lawrence's actual bike but that's about it. I was hoping to get a look at the brakes too because the real Broughs had an odd brake lever set up. Though they may have used a real for the beginning and then a fake for the wreck/jump.

His actual bike (that he wrecked):
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OqKeIqgrzAg&NR=1

Appreciate any help.

Amber Lamps · 11-25-2011, 10:53 PM

I'd bet it is a BSA or a Triumph....

derf · 11-25-2011, 11:26 PM

Bsa or enfield

Captain Morgan · 11-26-2011, 12:05 AM

No clue, but good grief, that was horrible to watch. I hate the "play the movie in fast forward to make it appear higher speed" crap. Not to mention the process of the "wreck" itself. Talk about inaccurate.

askmrjesus · 11-26-2011, 09:40 AM

It looks like a Brough to me, but I think it's an SS80 instead of an SS100.

The thing you have to remember about old Brit bikes, is that many of the marques bought engines from JAP, instead of making their own. This complicates matters. Brough used JAP engines, and then switched to units made by Matchless later on.

The engine in the film bike, is definitely a JAP. The exhaust angle is unusual for a Brough, but then again these bike are known as "Bitsa's" in the UK, (bits of this, bits of that), so who knows.

I can't tell what was flying though the air in the jump scene, but I wouldn't be surprised if they used the same bike. Having worked in Hollywood, I can tell you that movie makers aren't generally sentimental when it comes to machines. They break all kinds of perfectly good shit. Lawrence of Arabia was an epic, with a huge budget. If they could blow up a real train, (which they did) crashing a Brough would not be out of the question.

There is a Brough owners club. Get in touch with one of those old codgers, and find out if I'm right. If anybody could tell you, it would be one of those guys.

JC

askmrjesus · 11-26-2011, 09:55 AM

Found it:

webmaster@broughsuperiorclub.com

Good luck.

JC

Particle Man · 11-26-2011, 08:53 AM

Another vote for BSA. AMJ would know...

Particle Man · 11-26-2011, 10:14 AM

See?

Smittie61984 · 11-26-2011, 05:54 PM

Thanks AMJ.

I watched the beginning on DVD again and was able to notice a little more. The bike in the wreck had a silver tank so it was different from the 1st. Also not too suprised that they would wreck a rare bike.

Hopefully I can dig up some good stuff and the guy's at brough superior could help.

askmrjesus · 11-26-2011, 09:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Particle Man

See?

It's just an educated guess. I know more about old bikes than I do about new ones.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Smittie61984

Thanks AMJ.

I watched the beginning on DVD again and was able to notice a little more. The bike in the wreck had a silver tank so it was different from the 1st. Also not too suprised that they would wreck a rare bike.

Hopefully I can dig up some good stuff and the guy's at brough superior could help.

My pleasure. I love a good vintage bike riddle.

If you can't find joy with the Brough Superior club, try this chick:

kelly@kellydawnfisher.org

She was the production coordinator for "The Making of Lawrence of Arabia", which was a documentary about the original film. I doubt she knows the answer, but she might know somebody who knows somebody.

JC

11-25-2011, 10:21 PM	#1
Smittie61984 I give Squids a bad name Join Date: Mar 2008 Location: Fly Over State Moto: 1996 CBR600 F3 (AKA the Flying Turd) Posts: 4,742	Brough Superior (Lawrence of Arabia) I have a history project thingy where we had to pick a historical movie and write about something within the movie that may be inaccurate or just interesting. Such as say in a Vietnam movie having soldiers use a current generation M16 vs using a 1st generation M16. I picked Lawrence of Arabia because I knew of the motorcycle scene and that T.E. Lawrence was a motorcycle enthusiast. Specifically with the Brough Superiors. Now being that they made the movie in the early 60s and Brough quit making their bikes in the early 1940s I'm guessing that no one in hell would actually crash/lay down a real Brough Superior (if they did they should be slowly tortured to death) which they did in the movie. I figured they tried to replicate the bike with another brand of bike. I think they did that in a Tom Cruise movie by dressing a KTM up as a Ducati Hypermotard. Does anyone know what actual bike they used in the movie? Here is the scene: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GzPr3R3DNoo I can tell the exhaust is different from Lawrence's actual bike but that's about it. I was hoping to get a look at the brakes too because the real Broughs had an odd brake lever set up. Though they may have used a real for the beginning and then a fake for the wreck/jump. His actual bike (that he wrecked): http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OqKeIqgrzAg&NR=1 Appreciate any help. __________________ lifts - R.I.P.

11-26-2011, 09:40 AM	#5
askmrjesus Soul Man Join Date: Nov 2008 Location: Everywhere, all the time. Moto: '0000 Custom Turbo Cross (with jet kit). Posts: 6,481	It looks like a Brough to me, but I think it's an SS80 instead of an SS100. The thing you have to remember about old Brit bikes, is that many of the marques bought engines from JAP, instead of making their own. This complicates matters. Brough used JAP engines, and then switched to units made by Matchless later on. The engine in the film bike, is definitely a JAP. The exhaust angle is unusual for a Brough, but then again these bike are known as "Bitsa's" in the UK, (bits of this, bits of that), so who knows. I can't tell what was flying though the air in the jump scene, but I wouldn't be surprised if they used the same bike. Having worked in Hollywood, I can tell you that movie makers aren't generally sentimental when it comes to machines. They break all kinds of perfectly good shit. Lawrence of Arabia was an epic, with a huge budget. If they could blow up a real train, (which they did) crashing a Brough would not be out of the question. There is a Brough owners club. Get in touch with one of those old codgers, and find out if I'm right. If anybody could tell you, it would be one of those guys. JC __________________ The way things are going, they're gonna crucify me.

11-26-2011, 09:55 AM	#6
askmrjesus Soul Man Join Date: Nov 2008 Location: Everywhere, all the time. Moto: '0000 Custom Turbo Cross (with jet kit). Posts: 6,481	Found it: webmaster@broughsuperiorclub.com Good luck. JC __________________ The way things are going, they're gonna crucify me.

11-26-2011, 05:54 PM	#9
Smittie61984 I give Squids a bad name Join Date: Mar 2008 Location: Fly Over State Moto: 1996 CBR600 F3 (AKA the Flying Turd) Posts: 4,742	Thanks AMJ. I watched the beginning on DVD again and was able to notice a little more. The bike in the wreck had a silver tank so it was different from the 1st. Also not too suprised that they would wreck a rare bike. Hopefully I can dig up some good stuff and the guy's at brough superior could help. __________________ lifts - R.I.P.

11-25-2011, 10:53 PM	#2
Amber Lamps Moto GP Star Join Date: Mar 2008 Posts: 14,556	I'd bet it is a BSA or a Triumph....

11-25-2011, 11:26 PM	#3
derf token jewboy Join Date: Nov 2008 Moto: CBR 900, KLR ugly ass duckling, Gas Man Posts: 10,799	Bsa or enfield

11-26-2011, 12:05 AM	#4
Captain Morgan Let's do another U-turn Join Date: Feb 2008 Location: Indiana Moto: 2009 V-Strom Posts: 3,816	No clue, but good grief, that was horrible to watch. I hate the "play the movie in fast forward to make it appear higher speed" crap. Not to mention the process of the "wreck" itself. Talk about inaccurate.

11-26-2011, 08:53 AM	#7
Particle Man Custom User Title Join Date: Nov 2008 Location: Central NY Moto: 2003 SV650S Posts: 14,959	Another vote for BSA. AMJ would know...

11-26-2011, 10:14 AM	#8
Particle Man Custom User Title Join Date: Nov 2008 Location: Central NY Moto: 2003 SV650S Posts: 14,959	See?