Health Care..what do you think?

[Smittie61984]

Originally Posted by Papa_Complex

Yes, it's a moral issue: Are you the sort of person who would help your neighbour, or aren't you?
.

My neighbor? Yes I would. If he wants to borrow some sugar for some Kool-aid then not a problem at all. If he sends the police to my house to collect some sugar for himself then I'd have a problem.

If your "society" is so superior morally to ours then why is there a need to use the policing power of government, backed up by men with guns willing to violence on its behalf to take the money from people? If your society is such a moral society that cares about everyone then wouldn't people just give out of the kindness of their hearts?

My guess is that per capita American citizens GIVE more of their money to other people, countries, etc than Canada, Europe, or even devout communists/socialists. I think I remember seeing a stat that showed personal donations from Congressional leaders with the evil Republicans in the lead of most donations.

[Papa_Complex]

Guess all that you want. Would that money be from individuals, or government?

[askmrjesus]

Originally Posted by Smittie61984

Less bureaucracy with government???

Even with the "Bulk Discount" I doubt many people pay enough in taxes to have fully paid for their medical costs. Or basically if you pay $10000 in taxes directed at healthcare over say 10 years and you then have $100,000 in hospital costs. Then that $90,000 comes from someone else who was FORCED to pay for your costs.

I'm not paying higher taxes to pay for some fat ass who smokes, drinks, does drugs, and only gets up to change football games because their remote control broke's hospital bills. I'd rather them die for their shitty life decisions.

Again, it is a moral issue.

You're right, it is a moral issue. You're just on the wrong side of it.

That's OK though. A lot of people have decided not to be contributing members of society. You aren't the first, and you won't be the last.

The pity, really, is that while you detest the idea of helping anyone besides your non-smoking, non-drinking, non-drug doing, "God I'm so fucking perfect, I can't believe there are actually other people on the planet, and some of them are fat", self, you are perfectly willing to pay more than the citizens of any other Western nation, for health care.

Seems odd. As super-bitchen as you are, I would think you'd get health care for free. Why should you be paying for it, if you're not going to use it? You're silly.

Originally Posted by Smittie61984

Wether the socialist system will allow us to live and fuck for another 200years for cheaper is not the point. The point is someone is having the government take money from someone else to pay for your problem(s).

I don't give a fuck if it's the Dewey decimal system. If I can get jiggy with it for another 200 years, I am fucking golden.

Here's what the point really is. You already pay for someone else's problems. It's called insurance. That's how it works. X amount of people with X amount of problems, = X amount of profit. It ain't magic. If everyone paid in what they took out, insurance would be, "that thing we had before all the insurance salesmen went broke".

Supply and demand is not a new concept.

JC

[Smittie61984]

Originally Posted by askmrjesus

You're right, it is a moral issue. You're just on the wrong side of it.

Here's what the point really is. You already pay for someone else's problems. It's called insurance. That's how it works. X amount of people with X amount of problems, = X amount of profit. It ain't magic. If everyone paid in what they took out, insurance would be, "that thing we had before all the insurance salesmen went broke".

JC

How am I on the wrong side? You find it moral to take someone's money by force? If someone broke into your house to steal your TV to sell and buy some food so they can eat (or get healthcare), are you going to say "well they probably need it more than me"?

And with insurance I, yes I I I I I, say it as EYE have the option to pay for others or not. Same as those people have the option to pay for me. It is 100% voluntary unlike your government love fest of socialized medicine.

If you want to help people out, and if you are morally superior to me, then put your money where your mouth is and take your own fucking money and pay for the dumbass smoker's lung cancer treatment. I'll applaud you for your ACTION.

[was92v]

I wonder what we would live like with no Social programs forced on us at all? No Govt, no taxes, no hospitals, no roads or schools, or police or fire protection, no water, electric or sanitation or communications. Oh and no Doctors or medical since a lot of the education is paid for by govt grants and govt backed loans. Sounds like where I live, about 250 years ago. Though it probably would be more like the tribal areas of Afghanistan/Pakistan in reality. What a wonderful place to raise the kids in.

[Smittie61984]

Haha. That's just retarded.

First off I'm not advocating anarchy. I believe in the role of government but a minimal role, especially on the federal level.

I also find it funny that you guys think so little of yourself that you need someone like Biden or Bush to take care of you.

Originally Posted by was92v

I wonder what we would live like with no Social programs forced on us at all? No Govt, no taxes,
no hospitals - There are plenty of private hospitals that do 10x better than any governmetn ran hospital. Want to see a government run, fuck up of a hospital? Check out Grady Hospital in Atlanta. By the way they are currently bankrupt and full of corruption
no roads - Roads are essentially a voluntary tax. If you don't buy gasoline then you don't pay taxes for roadways. Interstates were originally set up for the US Military, a legit role of government. And most road construction is done by private contractors
no schools - Well those are just fuck up factories. You can go to some of the best private schools for less than a car payment. But gotta keep up with the Joneses.
No police or fire protection - Police protect innocent people from bad people. Well actually they usually just investigate a crime (legit role of government). Fire? Well i've advocated that if a tax exempt organization like a church decides not to pay property taxes, then if they catch fire, let it burn.
no water - Our government water is so great that we spend billions more a year buying it in a bottle from PRIVATE COMPANIES
electric - Your electricity almost always comes from private companies. Here in Georgia I know of Georgia Power, Jackson EMC, Walton EMC, and then various other ones.
sanitation - Sanitation? Again, most sanitation departments are PRIVATELY owned
communications - Communications are done by private companies (I work for one), AT&T, Verizon, and Comcast to name a few
no Doctors or medical since a lot of the education is paid for by govt grants and govt backed loans - Most med schools I know of are private schools. I know Emory and Mercer in Atlanta and Macon are. Not sure about Medical College of Georgia in Augusta. Hopkins, Mayo, Harvard, etc are also privat. You can trust your doctor from Devry if you want

Yeah, we're helpless without Big Brother.

[askmrjesus]

Originally Posted by was92v

I wonder what we would live like with no Social programs forced on us at all? No Govt, no taxes, no hospitals, no roads or schools, or police or fire protection, no water, electric or sanitation or communications.

I imagine we'd just roam the wasteland looking for gasoline.

JC

[tommymac]

Originally Posted by askmrjesus

I imagine we'd just roam the wasteland looking for gasoline.

JC

Can I be the humungus

Tom

[101lifts2]

Originally Posted by sherri_chickie

....How is healthcare different that house or car insurance? You still pay car insurance and house insurance, Do you think that you will pay enough to pay for your house if it were to burn down and you filed a claim? To me it looks no different that what you say we do when we " STEAL" from others forced to pay for our treatment......

You don't have to own a car, nor a house, but you want to be forced to pay for someone else's health insurance because you are simply "living"?

Car insurance is mandated because you could fuck up someone else's vehicle in an accident and home fire insurance is only required IF you have a mortgage (bank covering ass). Both are covering others loses due to your neglegence, though health care is not the case.

[101lifts2]

Originally Posted by Papa_Complex

Prior to the credit melt-down, health care costs were your nation's primary cause of insolvency. That points to a pretty large problem. Our problem is excessive wait times for non-critical operations......

The primary reason was insufficient insurance because the 52in plasma was apparently more important then adequate health insurance.

Should we declare vehicle body shop costs a large problem if I go out, drive w/o car insurance and smack up 3 cars I cannot afford to fix?